Swinging Didn’t Fix Us—It Freed Us

In this episode, we're getting real about how we got into the lifestyle.

We weren't struggling.

We weren't bored.

Our sex life was already damn good, maybe too good.

We'll talk about how curiosity evolved from real sex on HBO to pillow talk and playful boundaries.

Why communication and honesty were the keys from the start.

How Dave's solo habits opened up space for deeper trust between us.

Whether you're already swinging or just starting to have the conversation, this is a story that shows it doesn't have to start from struggle.

Welcome to Coming Out Swinging, a raw.

Real look at modern relationships.

I'm Dave Arena.

And I'm Victoria Arena.

We've been together nearly 30 years, married over 24, and swinging for more than 22.

We're starting this podcast now because for too long, fear kept us from living authentically, from being open about who we are and what our relationship actually looks like.

Maybe this is our modern day Scarlet.

Letter, but we're here to be both the example and the invitation to help others own their desires and question the scripts we've all been handed.

What's broken in today's relationships?

Is monogamy even natural for humans?

And could the secret to a relationship that doesn't drain your soul be owning other people?

This show explores how love, sex, and identity often buckle under the weight of societal expectations, especially monogamy.

Subscribe to Coming Out Swinging, the podcast that redefines couple goals straight from the OGs.

All right, so this episode, we're going to get into why we started swinging.

Yeah, we were.

No, I'm just kidding.

It's a good question.

I think our origin story is a little.

Well, I don't want to say it's different.

Different.

But we were newly married within, what, less than two years, Right?

Yeah.

Now, we had been together for a few years before that.

Correct.

But we were not.

I mean, it wasn't like we were married forever and trying to spice things up or.

No, no, no.

I mean, we already had a really good sex life.

I mean, I believe.

Yeah, we never had a lot of fun.

We weren't like.

We weren't, like, boring whatsoever.

Yeah, we never had that problem.

Problem.

And so it wasn't like something was broken at the time.

It wasn't even really to spice things.

I mean, I guess you could say to spice things up.

Anything we ever did was to spice things up.

But.

But I don't think we felt like we needed it at the time.

I think at the time, we always.

We were just like a regular, normal couple.

Like, you know, you do things to keep it spicy in the bedroom or not so mundane.

And, you know, I'm, you know, not just lay there, I guess you could say.

And.

Yeah, we've never been ones for, like, stroking each other's hair, staring into each other's eyes, you know, So I think it was just something.

We always tried to enhance everything we did.

Yeah.

And I think it started when.

I think back at some of the things that started us off, and it's.

We're going to be dating ourselves here, but we would watch, like, Real Sex on hbo.

Yeah.

And for you.

For those of you that don't know, HBO had a late night show called Real Sex.

Like, it was maybe every Friday night or every Saturday night or something like that came out once a week.

And they delved into, like, it was like, reality.

So they went to, like, you know, bunny ranches or they went to strip clubs or they, you know, taxicab confessions and all kinds of things.

And it just was real sex life stuff that was out there that people thought probably was taboo at that time.

Yeah.

And whether we were into whatever it was or not, we were so into the show because I think we were like.

We loved the fact that all these different things.

Things could push boundaries.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And it just.

Something spoke to us even back then.

Yeah.

And I don't remember specifically if there.

If there was anything specific on Swinging that got us.

No.

From the show or it was just the show in general showing all the different possibilities.

Yeah.

And I think, you know, it showed even then.

Like, women going with their husbands to, like, strip clubs.

Right.

And I think initially, like, that was something that we tried in the very beginning as well.

Like, we tried toys, which, you know, you had a lot of fun with toys.

But I don't know that it was necessarily always our thing.

Yeah.

We had, like a phase.

Yeah.

Like, it was fun for, you know, when it lasted.

But then you evolve again.

You.

It's constantly an evolution, sexual evolution.

I think when you're in a cup, a couple that wants to be adventurous and just, you know, see or try different things.

Yeah.

What's interesting about that is I believe the more we evolved and when we actually did cross the line into swinging, I think the excitement of real.

This sounds horrible.

Real life or not toys.

Right.

Yeah.

Made the toys obsolete.

And.

And I.

I don't want to say because I.

And that's, with all due respect to people that still love toys or still, like, as I.

I still think there.

Could be a great thing.

There could be a place for that people do swinging with, with toys and incorporate it.

I think for us it was like the toys were more like we were using them for fantasies.

Yeah.

And I think, I mean now if you look at where we've evolved for swinging, it's.

People are our toys in.

In.

In a.

Yeah.

Very respectful way.

And I don't ever want to be.

Yeah.

I don't.

We always said we'll be like honest and transparent.

I don't, I don't want to be crude, but like whether it was size.

Different size of toys or different races of toys.

Have races.

Yeah.

I mean, I guess you can, you can get, you can get it in.

Yeah.

For sure.

But it started with those.

We were using the toys for those kind of fantasies.

And then when we had the real fantasies, we didn't just need the toy, we didn't need the toys anymore.

Right.

And then I think the last part of it is then the pillow talk.

The pillow talk from there about the different scenarios.

The communication we had with each other through pillow talk was quite spicy.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

We kept it real with.

What if people don't know what pillow talk is?

I mean, I think that's selfish.

But we never wanted to.

I mean, I guess I can.

Layman's the term.

You know, definition that for you.

I would say pillow talk is when you're being intimate and you're.

It's, you know, it's that sexy talk.

It's that like, you know, he whispers a fantasy, you whisper a fantasy or you say, oh, yes.

Or I, I want to see this.

Or I can picture you doing that.

That's pillow talk.

Right.

So we started talking about the different fantasies.

Like with other people.

Yeah.

Maybe not specific people, but just.

No.

Yeah.

Just in general, but like.

Yeah, that's how it got to specific people.

But.

Right.

So I think that's how it started.

And then there was another component as well, you know.

And you know, and then also I think there were some other things going on as well.

Just based on.

I pass and I'll let you kind of get into that.

Okay.

So why don't you give the background on you?

Okay.

Yeah, I'll start with it.

Okay.

So I only had one relationship before you, as you know.

Yes.

Which was not a very good relationship, short lived.

So I don't even consider that.

I'd like to black it out.

But when I say only relationship, like, I'm talking high school.

Like never dated anyone, never had a girlfriend, never went to any dances.

Like nothing.

Right.

And so growing up basically single when I was.

Started working and had some money, like, I was on my own.

So whether it was porn or going to strip clubs or going to, again, dating myself back to the, like, video arcades and the stuff when.

When you used to be able to buy movies and stuff.

Now.

Oh, yeah, the younger generation knows nothing about that.

Yeah, those were like, you know, I had my independence.

Those.

And I think those habits, they showed up early in our marriage.

And, like, that's where I want you to go with it.

Like, where I think it wasn't that.

I didn't know about them because you were.

We were pretty clear.

I mean, like, I knew about porn and I knew about.

You went to strip clubs.

I mean, those were talks we had.

I kind of had, you know, a typical.

We were young too, when we got married.

I mean, like, you know, early 20s.

So, like, I had always in the back of my head, a typical, you know, female thing.

What if this could get.

What if this could become more.

So why can't I have a conversation with my husband and say, wouldn't it be hotter if I was involved?

Like, why can't we watch it together?

Why can't we go to the strip club together?

We saw it.

People do it on Real Sex, you know, whatever.

We started having these conversations that were probably a little uncomfortable for you, but I was really good at, I believe, making you think about this.

Think outside the box.

Yeah.

So would it be fair to say that it wasn't like, what you said?

It.

It wasn't.

I wasn't hiding it.

No, necessarily.

No.

But you would say part of that was fear.

Fear of, like, what could this develop into if you.

If that was the only thing you wanted to keep to yourself?

You know what I mean?

Right.

Or could it escalate to further things?

Yeah, absolutely.

I 100 had those things in my head.

And then the really cool thing, though, I think for both of us is that it turned into something that may have started as a fear or something where it's like, let's talk about this.

And you're.

You've always been like that.

You're a confronter.

You're someone who likes things out in the open.

You like to talk about it.

I'm more a little bit.

Dave likes to sweep it under the rug and hide it.

Yeah.

So.

But it became, surprisingly to me, at least, this is what started our whole journey because it became exciting.

It became exciting that we could have those conversations and we can also share in those things together.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Even stupid stuff that it Started with like you would on social media or whatever you would, you know, or even in public you would, you would be the like, oh, check her out.

Where most guys are getting hit upside the head if they check out a girl, right?

And then so even, like, I know that sounds stupid, but like that started making me feel like, like we have something that most couples don't have.

Like we can, we can play like that, we can joke like that.

And then it became even further, like social media.

You follow like models or you'd be like, oh, you need to check her out.

And like it wouldn't even be on my radar.

And now I'm following all these, like.

What I have to say.

Now that I look back on it, the more I could see you kind of get like excited about that in your eyes or like, whoa, did she just point that person out to me type of thing.

I could see your reaction.

It was almost boy like.

But then it gives me some sort of an empowerment a little bit like, haha, he wants to do this with me, he's not gonna go out with the guys.

Like he'd rather.

He's got his wife at home, he can, you know, we can go and do this together type of thing.

And that's what surprised me is how much I got into that.

And then, so then the next level when we actually started going to like strip clubs, that was insane because it wasn't like couples didn't go.

I think it's probably more common now.

Oh yeah, Back then, yeah, you got groups of girls that'll just go by them.

Back then we still would get the reaction from like the doorman and stuff or the, or the, the women.

And they would be like, oh, this is so cool that you guys go together.

Yeah.

So again, it gave me, it gave us that sense of like, oh, we're doing stuff that most couples don't do.

And I think that built the foundation for being completely open, completely judgment free.

The communication level before we had even started anything physical, before we had started swinging or swapping or any of that, just on this foundation, that's what started the communication at a deep, deep level.

Yeah, completely agree.

And also it took away the shame and not having to have any secrets either.

And when I say shame, like, even though I say that I did all that when I was single, I think there's always like a little bit of a.

Like, I think that's why you kind of hide porn.

And so I think that's why guys hide porn because it's like, it's you.

Know, it's supposed to be under the bed.

Yeah.

And even if you're single doing it on your own, you still feel like I really shouldn't need a drive on your computer.

Yeah.

Like so I think it just opened all of that up and like the trust level and I think it also eliminated.

And I know this is going to sound.

And maybe you had a fear that this would go there eventually.

Whether it's cheating or will it turn into something physical.

I think it really did eliminate the need for any of that.

Now I don't know if I ever would have gone down that road.

Because you just don't know.

Right.

So I'm not going to be naive and say, oh, I never would have done that because who knows?

Yeah.

But I definitely, definitely could say 22 years later in the lifestyle that it has eliminated the need to go outside because we do it all together.

Correct.

And that's what I find to be.

And even like the communication, like I said, that's the best non sexual benefit I think is that we can talk about things that most couples don't talk about.

And we, we see a lot of couples that do not communicate.

I'm not talking about swinger couples, I'm talking about vanilla couples who they're not either, they're, they're not intimate, they're not talking to each other at all, let alone talk at the level that we do about the stuff we talk about.

Correct.

And I just think that that's been the biggest difference on this whole journey.

But even starting back then, like this is, I guess what I'm saying is even before we started getting into the lifestyle, just the pillow talk, just the other things we were doing totally allowed us to be like, oh, there's something here where we can keep evolving and keep going.

Because we felt like the trust and the communication were on a whole nother level.

Yeah, I completely agree.

So I think for us, you know, we're, you know, where we were at at that point was we were leaning into a connection that we definitely already had, which was great.

We were aligned, we were being adventurous, we were being honest and open with each other.

And you know, it started to build so much extra curiosity and trust and we were just building on top of that.

It was like almost like building a pyramid, I think for us.

Yeah.

And the next logical step was then to jump into the jump in full, go to the swinger pool and, and like that.

But when I look back on it, it's funny because we'll get into our evolution once we were in the lifestyle of how we kept making like we kept experimenting with things to make it more exciting.

Yeah.

But when I look back on it, we started that way.

We started with the little, like we didn't realize it, but even before the swinger lifestyle, it was like these little steps that each step was getting a little more exciting, a little more open and a little bit more.

And then finally we were at the point where none of this other stuff was giving us.

I don't want to say it wasn't giving us the excitement, but eventually it kind of wore.

Like the strip clubs, especially when you're paying for stuff.

We were just like, why are we like spending all this money?

I think just the next logical step was then like, okay, maybe we should look into this.

And the pillow talk got more heated and more graphic and more real, more exciting.

Yeah.

And then we just, you know.

Yeah.

Took the plunge.

Right.

Which definitely we'll get into the next episode, how we got into it in our first time and everything.

But yeah, this was the build up.

Right.

This was the.

But I think again, it wasn't even the physical stuff as much as it was.

What surprised us was the level of our communication that we were like, ooh, this is kind of cool.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

So I mean, your relationship doesn't have to be broken to explore your sexual fantasies.

Whether it's swinging, whether it's.

And it doesn't have to be swinging.

Like even if you.

And I think any time you feel strong enough with your foundation of what you have as a couple, it's.

You're just.

Yeah.

You're just making it better.

Your experience.

Your experiences, whether it's in the privacy of your own bedroom or you're planning on, you know, jumping off the ledge and trying other things.

And I think that that's when you have that level of trust and communication and you're doing things together and you're realizing what you're getting out of it, both of you.

That's when you have a higher chance of lasting.

Even if you do decide to go further into the physical.

Yeah.

When I say physical, meaning you're actually going to go into those non monogamous world, you know, so, you know, I think, I mean, what's some advice you would give in terms of like, I.

Mean, I think my, my personal advice would be to talk early, talk often.

Yeah.

You're good at that.

Get curious together.

It can be uncomfortable at first, but make it fun.

Yeah.

The cure.

Curious is a great word.

Yeah.

Because I think that's what we're getting at.

No matter what it was we were into.

Yeah.

Even like, we started with the real sex.

Right.

For us, it was.

That was the curiosity, like, that was like, oh, even if we weren't into certain things, we're like, oh, that's kind of cool that someone else is into that, you know?

Yeah.

And, you know, I think.

I'm not trying to, like, tout whatever, but, I mean, I was a good girl.

So, like, things you saw in real sex, I was like, that freaking exists.

Yeah.

What the hell.

Yeah.

You know, and it just led to really, like, fun talks and, you know, and I think as long as there's that open book of communication that you really have with a solid foundation, it can be a lot of fun.

It really can.

Yeah, I think so.

And I.

I think it's really about just expanding.

Yeah.

You know, expanding the relationship, expanding what you're both into and also learning more about what each other is into to.

Which has also surprised us along the way.

Which we'll get into in other episodes as well.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Well, I think that's going to be it for this episode of Coming Out Swinging.

Thanks.

We'll see you guys next time.

If you're digging this, make sure to subscribe, leave us a review and follow us on TikTok at Vic and Baby.

We'd love to help you redefine couple goals through non monogamy without the mess.

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We'll see you next time.